Fanball Forums Issue! GSL move?

[smithkt]

The following is a post I made on the MSL message board where a similar discussion is taking place regarding an MSL move. I thought I would share this here for the other SL's to consider while they discuss this issue as well

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Just wanted to address some of the pro's/cons of using MFL's standard vs deluxe leagues. I am not going to address the concern of how to collect money here. This information is being provided simply as a "What if?" concept.

The primary difference between a standard and a deluxe league is the ability to control whether a player can be on more than one roster AND limit the duplicate players by conference or division. With a standard league you can not do both. This would effectively allow the four individual conferences to operate in one league, yet maintain separate player pools, waiver wires, trades, etc.

Cost

Standard:
$69.95 per league if ordered by June 15
$79.95 per league if ordered by July 31
$89.95 per league if ordered on or after August 1

Deluxe:
$139.90 per league if ordered by June 15
$159.90 per league if ordered by July 31
$179.90 per league if ordered on or after August 1

The obvious first advantage to the deluxe league is the total cost is lower.

Four separate leagues would be $279.80 assuming the pre-June 15 price. That just under $6 per team for 48 teams. Compare this to the deluxe league cost of just under $3 per team.


Commish access

Using separate leagues, the individual commishes could have separate passwords and would also have the ability to take advatnage of the ability to quickly toggle between "commish" and "owner" status.

Using a deluxe league, the individual commishes would have to share the password and lose the option to toggle between modes. They would instead have to log in and out to switch modes. One advantage to this is the fact that you would have four commishes who would have the power to correct problems, but this could also be accomplished by simply sharing the individual league password anyway....

Reporting

From the MFL site:

What are the major limitations of deluxe leagues?

* Several reports and pages, including the "process waivers" page, the "rosters" report, and more, are not broken out by division/conference. This is just an appearance issue, and in no way affects the core functionality of the league operation.

In other words, looking at the rosters report will show you all 48 teams, not just the teams in your conference. Same thing for the waiver order lists and such. There have been requests to modify these reports to provide the ability to limit the view to specific conferences. I strongly believe this will be fixed before the 2007 season begins.

Championship League

The deluxe league setup currently has a limit of four conferences. This is perfect for the main MSL leagues, but leaves the CL out in the cold. There really is no option here, though I do plan an making a request to bump the limit to 5 or 6.



Those are some of the things I can think of off the top of my head which would have to be considered if we were to think about making a switch.

[Musesboy]

MFL - The Good

Live scoring is accurate and almost instant.

Support is excellent.

Draft cards by round are the norm.

Waivers could be set to process at any convenient time.

Trades could have any deadline we want and could process instantly if required.

Players picked up in waivers could be traded or dropped in the same week. How often have you picked up a bye week replacement only to see that he was added to the injury report later?

If an owner made a mistake, we would have the power to correct it. Sometimes owners drop the wrong player and instantly email the commish, but they are powerless to correct the problem.

We could allow line up changes right up until game time. So there would be no more guessing whether a player will play in a late game or on Monday night.

History would be kept of every previous season.

Points allowed by position is readily available.

We could tweak the scoring if required. Defensive scoring is a joke at Fanball for example.

We could revert to 2 RBs required instead of flex, or any other line up change - if the masses wanted it.

Injury reports and line up records are automatically sent.

Waivers could be set for more than one round.

We could make statistical changes.

No owner would ever be able to hold the league to ransom by not leaving and refusing to set a line up, or by dropping all their players etc.

MFL - The Bad

Payment is by league, not by owner. It would have to be collected by check or Paypal.

Disputes may occasionally occur, whereas owners could have no complaint if the Fanball limitations prevented some problems from being resolved.

People are used to Fanball and some would be scared of change. Navigation is simple, but it looks odd at first if Fanball is all you have ever known.

Inertia will inevitably cause some owners to drop out if we move.

[smithkt]

musesboy said:

Disputes may occasionally occur, whereas owners could have no complaint if the Fanball limitations prevented some problems from being resolved.

Great summary Muses, but could clarify this point? I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say. Could you give an example?

[Musesboy]

smithkt said:

musesboy said:

Disputes may occasionally occur, whereas owners could have no complaint if the Fanball limitations prevented some problems from being resolved.

Great summary Muses, but could clarify this point? I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say. Could you give an example?

Yeah...

Suppose I drop Shaun Alexander in waivers by mistake. At MFL I could email the commish, explain that I hit the wrong button, and ask to have it reversed. That might cause the commish to hold a league vote or have to make a tough decision.

At Fanball, the commish has no such powers. He might be able to declare the player off limits, but the team would still be without that player for at least a week. If it happened in Week 13, then the player would be gone for the year.

Another example... if there were a scoring change, there might be an argument whether to apply it or leave it. At Fanball there is a definite cut-off point and it is done centrally without any league involvement.

There must be hundreds of possible scenarios where leagues could have a dispute. That is why rules, particularly in dynasty leagues, need to be exhaustive. We could simply duplicate the exact Fanball rules and settings of course, but then we would lose some of the potential advantages that MFL has to offer.

[smithkt]

Thanks for the clarification.

These types of issues can all be addressed with proper planning and clearly defined by-laws. It's probably d**n near impossible to try to anticipate every contingency, but there is a pinned thread over in the Shark Pool at FBG that provides a pretty solid list of things that should be considered.

I'm not sure I would consider this a con. The simple fact that you have control over it should make it a pro.

[Musesboy]

smithkt said:

Thanks for the clarification.

These types of issues can all be addressed with proper planning and clearly defined by-laws. It's probably d**n near impossible to try to anticipate every contingency, but there is a pinned thread over in the Shark Pool at FBG that provides a pretty solid list of things that should be considered.

I'm not sure I would consider this a con. The simple fact that you have control over it should make it a pro.

Yep, but you see my point. The commissioner may have to be a lot more involved if we move. Owners know that Fanball sucks, but if something is wrong they know that nothing can be done because of those limitations. Some people just wouldn't want the potential for extra work. Fanball leagues practically run themselves.

I think any move away from Fanball will never happen. It SHOULD happen, but I don't think there is the slightest chance that it will. We have played there for four or five years in the GSL, and almost as long for the other leagues. We know the limitations. People deal with it and work around it. They don't like change. I would be happy to move, even knowing I would have to collect the money. But I am a realist and I know it won't happen.

[smithkt]

I do see your point. I think it comes down to whether the commishes are willing to be more hands on or prefer to do nothing more than get the draft going....

I'm not afraid to get my hands dirty. ;D

A move won't happen if each SL will only move with 100% agreement. To Mark's point earlier, it may be that some tough choices are going to have to be made. I can't speak for anything but the MSL, but I see people who are no longer willing to stay. The reasons vary, but the stagnation of the current product is starting to take it's toll. Quality owners are walking away. I'm still trying find out whether it will reach a critical mass, or if it will only be a handful that leave. I wish I knew for sure. If the numbers are large enough and the commishes of the individual leagues are in agreement, it may be better for the long term to just make the move and fill the holes. Some of the people resistant to the change may change their minds. Some won't.